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Robbie
Contributing Member
Joined: 13 Feb 2007
Posts: 76
Location: Edinburgh
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 Posted: Thu Feb 15, 2007 4:53 am Post subject: Het chances and all that, can someone explain. |
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Hiya,
I've been looking at buying a pair of het albinos, I just presumed that a het pair would produce half visual and half normal. However, after reading up a bit i find myself confused. Can someone explain (in detail if possible) all the percentage likely hoods when breeding hets to possible hets, hets to visuals etcetc? Also, does the rule (which I hope someone can explain) apply to all morphs?
I would be very thankful for your help.
Robbie  |
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cjreptiles
Contributing Member
Joined: 25 Oct 2006
Posts: 133
Location: Bristol
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| Posted: Thu Feb 15, 2007 5:22 am Post subject: Re: Het chances and all that, can someone explain. |
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| Robbie wrote: | Hiya,
I've been looking at buying a pair of het albinos, I just presumed that a het pair would produce half visual and half normal. However, after reading up a bit i find myself confused. Can someone explain (in detail if possible) all the percentage likely hoods when breeding hets to possible hets, hets to visuals etcetc? Also, does the rule (which I hope someone can explain) apply to all morphs?
I would be very thankful for your help.
Robbie |
Okay. Every person has two copies of every gene (one from mother and one from father). In a recessive trait, such as albinism, both of these copies must be code for albinism for the trait to be displayed - i.e. for the animal to be albino. If only one of the genes is 'albino', while one is normal, they animal will be heterozygous (het) - so, while it looks normal, it still carries one gene for albinism.
If you call the gene 'A', 'A' is a normal gene, while 'a' is one that codes for albinism. An albino is aa, a het is Aa, and a normal (non-het) is AA.
When you breed two hets (Aa) together, one gene is taken from each parent. The best way to represent this is an a punnet square. An Aa x Aa mating will give the following results:
A a
A AA Aa
a Aa aa
As I said before, AA is normal (non-het), Aa is het. albino, aa is albino. So the theoretical results (in practice, they will always be slightly different) are 25% normal, 50% het. albino, 25% albino.
As you cannot tell the normals apart from the hets just by looking at them, the phenotype ratio is 75% normal, 25% albino. However, you know that, from this "75%" of normals, there is twice as much chance of getting a het as not, so all normals are labelled as "66% poss het albino".
If you breed at het (Aa) to a visual albino (aa), you will get half albinos and half het albinos. If you breed a normal (AA) to an albino (aa), you will get all hets (Aa).
You ask does this rule apply to all morphs. It applies to all RECESSIVE morphs, such as albinos and piebalds (although, from my limited knowledge of royal morphs, I believe 'het piebald' royals may have markers?).
The rule does not apply to incompletely dominant (often referred to as co-dominant) morphs such as Mojave and pastels (I think!). In the case of incompletely dominant morphs, when one gene codes for the morph, it is displayed, while if both genes code for the trait a so-called "super" form is made (although this isn't really a genetic term!). In the case of the mojave, for example, a 'MM' individual would be normal; Mm = mojave; mm = "super mojave" (blue-eyed leucistic). Punnet squares can be used in same way to predict offspring ratios.
I don't know if you can also get dominant morphs (except the wildtype) in royal pythons, although you can in leopard geckos (which is more my field). In leopard geckos, the enigma is a dominant morph, so both EE and Ee individuals look the same (i.e. enigmas!) and there is no 'super' form.
Hope this helps a little and isn't too complicated/badly explained. If you need anything cleared up let me know. |
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Robbie
Contributing Member
Joined: 13 Feb 2007
Posts: 76
Location: Edinburgh
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| Posted: Thu Feb 15, 2007 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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Ah OK. Yes that clears alot up  Thank you both. I'll need to read on the specific morphs now. |
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Robbie
Contributing Member
Joined: 13 Feb 2007
Posts: 76
Location: Edinburgh
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| Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2007 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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Albino is my thing lol. I'd rather produce my own and the obvious choice (considering price and availability) would be a pair of hets.
Trying to find a pair, and I need someone who couriers. I can't travel. |
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good12
I've settled in...
Joined: 24 Nov 2006
Posts: 30
Location: wouldn't you like to know
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| Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2007 3:56 am Post subject: |
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hi can someone help me with this i got all the recessive and double recessive co-dominant,doable co-dominant,triple co-dominant,quadruple co-dominant and figured out that i pretty much got it all the genes thing but then i found out that you can get triple recessive which I'm not getting  so can someone explain it to me please.
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cjreptiles
Contributing Member
Joined: 25 Oct 2006
Posts: 133
Location: Bristol
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| Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2007 5:03 am Post subject: |
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| good12 wrote: | | hi can someone help me with this i got all the recessive and double recessive co-dominant,doable co-dominant,triple co-dominant,quadruple co-dominant and figured out that i pretty much got it all the genes thing but then i found out that you can get triple recessive which I'm not getting so can someone explain it to me please. |
By triple recessive you mean an animal that is homozygous for three different recessive traits (e.g. albino, piebald and genetic stripe...hmm wonder if that has ever been done). So in actual fact at the loci for each of these three traits, there are two 'mutated' alleles. That didn't help you at all 
Recessive, dominant and co-dominant have all been explained above. |
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cjreptiles
Contributing Member
Joined: 25 Oct 2006
Posts: 133
Location: Bristol
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| Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2007 5:05 am Post subject: |
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| cjreptiles wrote: | | good12 wrote: | | hi can someone help me with this i got all the recessive and double recessive co-dominant,doable co-dominant,triple co-dominant,quadruple co-dominant and figured out that i pretty much got it all the genes thing but then i found out that you can get triple recessive which I'm not getting so can someone explain it to me please. |
By triple recessive you mean an animal that is homozygous for three different recessive traits (e.g. albino, piebald and genetic stripe...hmm wonder if that has ever been done). So in actual fact at the loci for each of these three traits, there are two 'mutated' alleles (rather than normal/wild-type ones). That probably didn't help you at all
Recessive, dominant and co-dominant have all been explained above. |
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cjreptiles
Contributing Member
Joined: 25 Oct 2006
Posts: 133
Location: Bristol
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| Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2007 6:52 am Post subject: |
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| cjreptiles wrote: | | cjreptiles wrote: | | good12 wrote: | | hi can someone help me with this i got all the recessive and double recessive co-dominant,doable co-dominant,triple co-dominant,quadruple co-dominant and figured out that i pretty much got it all the genes thing but then i found out that you can get triple recessive which I'm not getting so can someone explain it to me please. |
By triple recessive you mean an animal that is homozygous for three different recessive traits (e.g. albino, piebald and genetic stripe...hmm wonder if that has ever been done). So in actual fact at the loci for each of these three traits, there are two 'mutated' alleles (rather than normal/wild-type ones). That probably didn't help you at all
Recessive, dominant and co-dominant have all been explained above. |
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Hmmm...that planned edit clearly didn't quite work in the way I had intended  |
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Robbie
Contributing Member
Joined: 13 Feb 2007
Posts: 76
Location: Edinburgh
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| Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2007 8:38 pm Post subject: |
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| PM'ed. Anyone else got a pair or even single 100% het albinos? Might buy in a male and afew females. Cheaper the better, obviously |
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snakeypete
Captivebred Communist
Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 1434
Location: Central Scotland
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 10:53 pm Post subject: Info please |
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| The Eggman wrote: | If you want to go for hets then albino is a good starting block,
If you want to got for codom then the same is true for pastels, Scott W has some stunning pastels for sale at the moment! |
Saw above post...wondering about you're price for Hets and visuals , for Albinos...and any other morphs you may deal in .
TIA
Pete
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We do not stop playing because we grow old;
we grow old because we stop playing. |
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