Reptile Forum, Reptile Classifieds - CaptiveBred

[JaySteel]

Firstly I'd like to say 'hello' to everyone.
I'm interested primarily in taking advice about purchasing one or more chameleons.
I recently visited a pet store near me that sells lizards and snakes and I fell in love with a Yemen / Vieled Chameleon. I'm aware of the costs involved and the fact that they need a heat lamp, UV lamp, plently of fresh air circulation, pre-dusted and loaded crickets etc...
I'm not sure that I want a chameleon that grows to 24-25" (including tail). Then I heard of the Von Hohnels Chameleon which is considerably smaller when fully grown. I haven't as yet found anyone selling these chameleons though. I've taken the time to do a bit of research on the internet and that's just made things more confusing. It's amazing how much information on one web-site contradicts another web-site when trying to get good advice about keeping these cameleons. There seems to be some discrepancy over how many you should keep in one vivarium, what size of viv and what style of viv they should be kept in. Some say that these make great pets that love to be picked up and others say that handling chameleons should be kept to a bare minimum as it causes the creature a great deal of stress.
No offense meant to anyone on here who runs or works in a pet store but I'm not sure how much I trust their advice as some seem to be more interested in getting the sale rather than the long term welfare of the lizard or the new owner.
Can anyone clear up any of these points?
Can anyone recommend a breed of chameleon that is happy to be handled and has a maximum body length (without tail) of 8-10" and doesn't require a 5-6ft vivarium?
To make things even harder my wife only likes green chameleons! lol

Thanks in advance for any help or advice you may be able to offer.

Jason

[felix93]

Hi and welcome

IMO, I think Yemen and Panther are better chams to start with but then they do need to have big viv to keep in. Have you consider having keeping them in mesh vivs as they are the alternative vivs and are great to keep chams in.

I keep 2 females Von Hohnels in the biggest exo terra tank, but I wouldn't receommend those glass tank to anyone to keep chams except they are babies because the ventilation is not good. My 2 are about 6 inches in length (measure from the nose to the tip of the tail) now. I usually leave the door open with a tiny gap at night for them just in case.

Regarding picking up, I think each cham is different. my Von Hohnels def hate to be picked up, in fact they try to run away if I put my hands in. So I try to leave them alone as much as I can. On the other hand, all my Yemans and Panthers can torelate being handle. They still hiss sometimes if they are not in a mood.

Have you thought of Jackson chams? They are also nice chams and they are easier to look after than Von Hohnels.

Anyway, there are a few very knowledgable chams owners / breeders on the board, I will let them answer your questions in more detail way.

[johne.ev]

If you want a chameleon that doesn't mind being handled look no further than a panther. if you go for a male you won't have trouble with egg laying. some veiled can be ok, but most are a bit stroppy. trouble with the smaller species is that most stress easily & dont like to be handled. not sure about carpet chams though, never kept them. you dont need a huge viv for panthers, a 3x3x2 (hwd) will be fine. in the warmer weather you can put them outside aswell. look for a nosey be (lovely green colour )

[kinyonga]

I have been keeping chameleons for many years now...and for the most part they do best being kept one per cage. Sometimes the signs of stress are not easy to see for someone who has had little experience with them.

In captivity they are stuck in the space we give them...in the wild, if they meet up and don't want to be together, they have lots of room to move away from each other. In captivity they are constantly having to be aware of the other chameleon...in the wild, again, they can move away from each other.

Regarding handling the chameleons...some will tolerate being handled and others need to be handled as little as possible. Some species are more tolerant than others. I generally leave it up to the chameleon....if it comes out on me willingly then I let it...if it hisses and gapes, etc. then I only handle it as much as is needed.

You said..."It's amazing how much information on one web-site contradicts another web-site when trying to get good advice about keeping these cameleons"...IMHO part of the reason for these contradictions is that people tell what has worked for them...or what they think has worked. Often they repeat what they have heard from others too...right or wrong. I think that some of the parameters for keeping chamelons have more room for error than others and unless that person steps over the limit, and the chameleon gets sick or dies then the "myth" continues on.

Regarding style of viv they should be kept in...part of it depends on where you live. If you lived in a hot climate and didn't keep the chameleon in an airconditioned area, then your chameleon would need to be in a screen cage. If you lived in a place that was usually cold and dry, then the chameleon would likely do better in a cage that was mostly glass. I have used glass cages for some species that need higher humidities and have had none of the problems that people usually say come with them...standing water, chameleon reacting to its reflection, respiratory issues, lack of air flow, etc. I'm not saying that these setups are easy to maintain or set up so that they work without problems, but they can and do work.

Here are some sites with good information...
http://www.chameleonnews.com/
http://www.adcham.com/
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/index.htm

[JaySteel]

Thank you all very much for taking the time to reply.
Would a 3x3x2ft viv with glass at the front and partially meshed sides give enough ventilation for a solitary vieled or panther cham?

[kroakykaren]

Hi and welcome to the forum, i mesh the roof on my Panther vivs and the small bottom panel so there is a good airflow my yemen is in an all mesh cage but if you did the roof and a good bit of the sides on a wooden one it would be fine for a yemen Have a search through the cham section there is lots of info..
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[johne.ev]

Put a couple of small vents in back wall, that should be fine. or replace glass with mesh door.