Reptile Forum, Reptile Classifieds - CaptiveBred

[Jas]

I know this was mentioned way back on here, but just wanted to know if anyone is getting regular success in hatching there Ackies out. I must be getting like a 5% hatch rate here and most of those are just when i intervene. Ive tried vermiculite/ perlite different temps and humidity but no noticable difference. All go the same way, grow full term and then die before hatching some have even slit the egg but still died. I have two females that are near to laying now and this time im going to just incubate the whole egg laying box to see if that makes any improvement. Judging by the amount of young Ackies you see for sale its a common problem. But does anyone care to share there hatching results and methods?
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[Sean]

I am starting to hear of this problem more and more normally with other species of odatria like glauerti, so I put this down to the bloodline being very limited so interbreeding may cause certain factors to happen. Although I have always had around 99-100% hatch rate so I personally have not had this problem. I always use perlite and keep it quite dry although if you squeezed it in your hands you would see the moisture left behind on your palm. As for temps mine are normally around 29-31c although in the summertime the background temps have gone very high but I have no control over this other than maybe using a fan in my reptile room, but having said that it as not had any baring on the eggs developing and therefore hatching. I also keep my eggs in darkness, I know some people do not.

[kev]

hi
i have had the same results as you from ackies and tristis ie full term dead young after pipping.
my experience is i grew a pair of ackies up from young , eventually i got a clutch of 8 eggs so incubated them in perlite and got all hatch normally.
3 months on another clutch so i incubated them the same as previously got 3 from 10 hatch from full term eggs.
another 3 months another clutch tried vermiculite 0 hatch most had slit the egg then not come out.
tristis were the same 1st clutch 100% hatch
2nd clutch full term dead
same for 3rd clutch.
so from my experience and results i came to the conclusion it is nutritionally related or maybe.
as previuos to the 1st clutch the females have months of plentiful food and growing so when mature the 1st clutch of eggs has plenty of resources from the female.
the female then has to replenish her resources from feeding heavily.
now even a day off each week from food may comprimise the females health to the extent that following clutches do not have the same resources to draw on as built up before the 1st clutch ,seeing as they only get 3 months to replenish what had built up for months previously before the next clutch.
i have another pair of ackies now and am trying the food available 24/7 approach see if that makes a difference.

[kev]

all your hatching eggs come from mouse eaters do they not sean?
i have not heard many instances of mouse / rodent eating monitor eggs going full term pipping then dying but have heard an awful lot of insect eating species having the full term problem.

[Jas]

Thanks for the reply Sean, these people you know who incubate in a lit incubator what are there hatch rates like?
As regards to inbreeding being a possible cause, could this be when you consider some of the other Australian lizards bred in large numbers.
Anyone else breeding Ackies?
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[Jas]

Thanks Kev, some interesting points you make there as thinking on it i also had good hatch rates on my first clutch and then they slowly got worse.
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[Siebren]

Typed this reply earlier today, but couldn't post it (now know why...)

Strange, I have an (estimated) hatch rate of about 95% (not counting eggs that are infertilized/weak-shelled to begin with, of which I usually have a few in each clutch, something I am working on to improve)

I do nothing fancy really. I use vermiculite (have tried perlite but doesn't work for me) which I soak till saturation. Then I squeeze out as much water as I can before using it to fill the containers. I incubate at 28,5 degrees Celcius and add water when eggs are caving (which anoyingly they usually do from underneath where you don't notice it so fast). With this method incubation takes exactly 4 months, and as said I have no trouble getting healthy young (hatched app. 25 this year)

I'dd say your results are more likely something in the diet, or something genetic. Females need huge amounts of calcium while forming the eggs, although you probably know that. Furthermore captive ackies have a very small genepool, maybe you would want to consider buying another male, just to rule out this variable?

Good luck, whatever you do!

[Sean]

Yes Kev of course nutrition is a factor, I think ackies should be fed mice as well as part of their diet in captivity which provide good calcium especially for egg producing females. I know you feed mice to your tristis and ackies so maybe there is something else behind this or a combination of reasons why the eggs do not hatch.

I remember you telling me about this at the time, I know it is a big problem with glauerti breeders but supposely all glauerti in Europe stem from the U.S. via Canada or direct and these only came fron a handful of animals so generations of interbreeding maybe a factor or maybe there was a problem with the founder stock which as carried through.

I find this interesting because what happens when only a few animals colonize new Islands how do they manage to overcome limited blood linage if there is a problem and no new blood to arrive.

[Thomas Shanta]

It must be very frustrating when eggs go full term and then fail,my Storri eggs looked good but went bad after 2 weeks but to get them to the point when you have a fully formed neonate is just I think no matter how much knowledge or technology we have nature will always do a better job.

[crocdoc]

I don't think it has to do with inbreeding at all, as I've seen others with the very same problem mating unrelated adults in other monitor species. Personally, I think it comes down to humidity levels in the egg box. In most cases that I have seen, the eggs were kept too moist, resulting in full term dead-in-egg embryos.

People who have hatched other reptiles have been astounded at how dry the perlite feels in my monitor egg boxes. I start off with 1:1 perlite:water by weight, which is probably a bit on the wet side for smaller monitors. Most of the monitor eggs I incubate are large, so they absorb a fair bit of moisture and by half way through incubation the medium is pretty dry.

Excuse the pun, but I monitor the eggs during incubation. If some appear a bit too turgid (when squeezed gently on the sides) or start to look too round, I move the turgid eggs to the centre of the egg box (least humid area). If some begin to dent too early, I move the dented eggs to the corners of the egg box (most humid area).

If that doesn't solve the problem, or if all of the eggs are either turgid or dented, I may reduce moisture levels by wiping off any condensation from the walls of the egg box, or add a very small amount of water, then check again in a week or two.

Close to hatching the eggs dent in a bit, but I usually ignore that.

For viable eggs, my hatch rate has been around 99% (was 100% but I had my first ever dead-in-egg this year as the eggs were a bit too moist).

Another sure-fire egg killer, aside from excess moisture, is poor nesting by the female at the time the eggs are laid. If the female is unhappy with the nesting areas and delays laying by a few days while she desperately searches for somewhere to lay, the eggs have a reduced chance of surviving. If the female nests, but poorly, there's even less of a chance. If she scatters the eggs, you can almost say bye bye (if not to the eggs, then to the female once she's done that a few times).