Reptile Forum, Reptile Classifieds - CaptiveBred

[poisonjedhead]

Hello

are any of you keeping white lipped pythons as i am keen on getting a pair and have heard many different views on there behavior and husbandry.

first hand experience would be welcomed.
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[lol93]

Haven't kept them, but I believe they can have quite mean temperaments.
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[poisonjedhead]

mmm... would think captive bred would be a little easier to manage than wild caught or farmed though, hope I'm right in thinking this.

Any one got some ideas?
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retierd and spending my childrens inheritance.

[charles thompson]

this is a care sheet i wrote. Not the gospel but relays my experiences with this species:

SPECIES: White Lipped Python (D’Alberts, D’Albertis Python)
SCIENTIFIC NAME: Leiopython Albertissi
NOTES:

This species holds a somewhat mystical allure that has captured many an enthusiasts heart, including mine over the years. It is amazing that a predominantly bi-coloured snake- (black head with either a brown, rusty or golden colour body) can culture such affection. The secret to this alert snake’s popularity is the amazing iridescence caused by its polished scales. The scales are so flat that they fragment light into the primary colours and as a result are covered in rainbows of colour. The sight on exceptional animals is quite literally amazing.
To maintain as captive bred animals there are two stages to be taken into consideration.

1. Hatchling-Yearling
2. Yearling onwards

Babies of this species regardless of whether they are captive bred or not require permanently higher humidity than in later life. By keeping this species too dry a serious risk of respiratory infection is present. I remember reading information on this species years and years ago which clearly stated that for the first 2 months of the snakes life it was best to maintain them in a incubator, basically, as this was the only proven way to keep the neonates alive. Most common causes of death in youngsters was respiratory infection. Obviously care techniques have advanced since then. I maintain youngsters in 3-9ltr storage boxes dependant on size of the inhabitant. Substrate used is paper and a large (proportionally) water container provided at the cool end. A toilet roll inner is provided as a hide and they get along quite happily in there. They rarely refuse defrost mice for me, when maintained in this manner. In fact they feed with gusto, although there are the snake’s unusual habits to consider. As the snakes start feeding on animals which have fur, some examples of D’Albertis pythons re-gurge the fur from the carcass they have eaten. There is a tendency for new keepers to panic! – “Oh no my snake is throwing its food up”. Don’t panic its completely normal for the species. This species like all other Indonesian Python grows fast.

For at least the first year I would urge you to keep the snake in modest easily cleaned environments. Keep the humidity up and importantly keep the enclosure clean. Respiratory infections can also come about from bacteria build up (common in high humidity environments). The temperature you want to maintain this species at is around 30 Celsius at the warmest end; I maintain them at this temperature and do just fine. Lower temperatures may aid humidity but could spark the onset of a cold (respiratory infection).

So let’s suppose we have got a year under our belt with no major disasters. At a year of age I would expect a White Lipped Python that had been feeding well to be 24-30 inches in length (this may be conservative but I am no fan of power feeding). We need a viv to put the wee chap in. I personally, would opt for a glass tank. Exoterra© make a fantastic range of glass tanks, the size I would opt for would be 12”x12”x18” (WxDxH), we don’t need to offer too much room straight away as there are problems associated with maintaining humidity in larger tanks. The heater I would recommend would be a pre-wired lighting dome from t-rex with a 50w Heat-Glo infra red bulb. Not only does this look really neat it also does a fantastic job. Air flow is good as front mounted vents below the front doors of the vivarium, and the grill at the top make for good convection removing old heated air with fresh cool air. Thermostatic control of this unit is imperative; there are not many species as sensitive to temperatures as neonatal and juvenile D’Albertis Pythons. I would recommend a Microclimate DL1 ME©. These systems are run by microprocessors not micro-switches making them one of the most reliable systems out there. As the bulb emits deep red light the light cycle of the animal can be set by a bright light with the room you intend to keep the animal(s). There is a light sensor on the front of the thermostat which picks up when it is light or dark and you can set the night time drop accordingly. You can then be in full control of light cycle as well as day time high and night time low.

Once the animal is settled it should continue feeding with no problems. In this species I have noticed the speed of growth slows considerably after 24 months. Most animals (of the Northern or golden morph) are sexually mature from 48” onwards as long as they carry sufficient body weight. This species does reach 5-6ft in the northern morph (the most commonly seen in captivity, the larger Southern morph is some what harder to come by and my experience with them is limited to only three male specimens). Stories of 7 ft Northern are heard of but I am still to see one (not to say that they don’t exist).

This is where they may be a sticking point for some people who have read this so far and think “way-hey I’ll get myself a pair of White Lips”. Think, these snakes are known to be bad tempered, especially wild caught specimens. Even captive bred animals can have temper close to the devil himself! There are occasions, although infrequent, where these animals will become 85-90% tame (never commit yourself to trusting the snake 100%, that is where mistakes happen!). Always keep these snakes at arms length they have a nasty habit of striking towards the face. It is this temper that makes them excellent feeders. Because they are so high strung and so strike happy when you are feeding your charge with its meal and it has wrapped its prey, FREEZE! – If you move the snake will almost certainly drop its prey and start re-striking at you! This may seem stupid reading this but honest to god it is what I experience year in, year out as I deal with around 20 heads of this species annually.

The Adult animals should be transplanted into a large tank measuring 24”x24”x18” (WxHxD). This should be plenty, if you keep them in a naturalistic manner keep well planted so as to offer refuge, the same heating principles can be implemented but use a more powerful bulb from the range, probably a 100w just to be on the safe side. These animals should only ever be housed singly as they do have aggressive tendencies and thin skin, serious injuries can result from keeping pairs or groups together permanently.

Not discussed here are the people who wish to keep them in a breeding style rack enclosure. This species of snake will need to migrate through approximately 3 stages of box. For ease I will use sizes of really useful box©. Babies can start life in a 3 litre box. The confined nature of the box will provide security and as a result you will get a better breeding response. I would keep this species in this box for as long as possible as they thrive on secure enclosures. The next stage of box would be a 35 litre box. The snake can be maintained in this box until it is nearly 3ft in length. The final box is the 84 litre box. The latter two boxes should be provided with permanent branches of either plastic or wood for the snake to perch. These snakes will use an opportunity to drape over branches on occasion. Conversely, they also enjoy to burrow so provide a deep litter of substrate or damp paper (dependant on the setup type you choose.). Heating is provided by heat strip pads controlled by a reliable thermostat. Make sure other species housed in the rack along side require the same temperatures so that you do not have to make compromises.

May I wish all keepers of White Lipped Pythons good look in the adventure that is maintaining this species, they are thoroughly rewarding as captives and it is hard to find an animal that eclipses the iridescent beauty of these taxa.
I do hope that this paper has been of some use.
Regards Charles Thompson
Owner @ Snakes’N’Adders


ADULT AVERAGE LENGTH: The average adult length of the animals we have encountered here at Snakes’N’Adders varies from 4-5ft in length. This species (the Northern form) can grow to 6ft (rarely more). The larger Southern form grows larger with a maximum size of 8-9ft. Although my experience is limited to three 4ft male specimens, hence why all information above must be considered only for the Northern or golden race.

DISTRIBUTION: The snakes we aquire arrive on Indonesian shipments only (unless captive bred – rarely). There are no specifics given to the exact locality they are collected from. I would assume Northern Papua New Guinea, West Papua in the Northern Range, Sorong and other Northern Islands.

HABITAT: Tropical forest, often near water, will climb readily and conversley burrow given the opportunity.

BREEDING: This species have been bred following our published breeding techniques on Cycling Tropical Boid Species. – Check Articles section under Boid sub-category.

KEEPER LEVEL (& REASONING): I think because of the fragile nature of the neonatal White Lipped Pythons it is only right that I should class these as Experienced Level Animals. We would certainly recommend you have kept other hardier species first such as Macklocks Pythons (Liasis Macklocki) and their cousin the Savu Island Python (Liasis M Savuensis). Other species to consider before White Lipped Pythons would be Blood Pythons (Python Curtus Ssp) (Any of the forms) or carpet pythons (Morelia Ssp). (Although Carpets won’t really be a challenge that may not prepare you well enough to keep White Lipped Pythons).

This care sheet is merely a guide and with the information here it cannot and should not be considered a whole care solution. Please research further as information on any new species to be kept is invaluable.
Suggested reading:
Reproductive Husbandry of Pythons And Boas – Ross & Marzec
Pythons of the World Vol 1 Australia – D & T Barker
Reptiles of Papua New Guinea – O’Shea
Non-venomous snakes – Trutnau
Keeping and Breeding Snakes - Mattison



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[center]Check us out: www.snakesnadders.com - Leeds pro reptile shop.
0113 2899911
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[poisonjedhead]

Thank you

Very informative, I've absorbed the info well along with other threads I've found that point in the same direction of husbandry.

busy setting up some tubs measuring humidity and temps and shall be picking up a pair of the we beasties next week...BIG GRIN.

One last thing out of interest how much ventilation do you use in your really useful box's to keep the humidity up and allow adequate ventilation?

thanks Jed
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retierd and spending my childrens inheritance.

[TopQualityPythons]

This is the female,

This is the male.
They are both Golden/Northern form & were captive bred by Luke Woolfenden @ http://www.woolfboids.co.uk in 2007.
I can testify that they require very close attention to their humidity requirements, with special attention to the time around their slough period. I keep several python sp & have occasionally had the dubious task of helping remove small unshed portions of snakeskin. Usually it'll just be the tip/last 2-3cm of tail skin that hasn't come off. However I was horrified to see one of my neonates looking a bit of a mess one morning. My feeding regimen had put both male & female into a slough cycle & I had missed the grey/blue/milky phase (mid slough period) completely. So a day after I had helped the female, there I was again giving the male a helping hand. After this I've kept a very close eye on their routine/cycles & always adjust the humidity to be on the excessively moist side for a few days prior to grey phase & thereafter until they shed. Branches Tubes/hides & bowls can all be helpful for them to remove skin, but without the humidity it can go very wrong. Leaving you with an unhappy snake in desparate need of your immediate assistance. I use newspaper substrate in ALL of my tubs & vivariums. It can be moistened with ease & replaced as frequently as necessary with minimal expense. It is also extremely hygenic with any soiled areas being visually more obvious than when utilising other more particle bases substrates.
In both cases mentioned above, I simply filled a large bowl with warm water (NOT HOT). I then gently cradled the snake in my hands whilst lowering it into the water. The natural movements of the lightly restrained snake was enough to remove most of the adhered skin patches. The tail of any snake can be one of the places a python doesn't like to have messed with. It was as I was tenderly rolling off these last portions that most of their aggression was vented. However they were very small & I don't think they even broke the skin of my hand. They were obviously going to be far more comfortable & content with the old skin fragments gone, so such a proceedure was essential to their wellbeing. The whole event probably took not more than 10-15minutes (each snake).
As far as a friendly White Lip or an unfriendly one, I firmly believe that any WC animal has the right to be more than a little upset about being removed from it's native environment where it's movements were totally unhindered, quite possibly be shipped half way around the world in who knows what kind of conditions, to then be placed into a box & have the bejesus frightened out of it every time the owner looks in through/walks past the viewing part of the vivarium.
But, if you have a cb/cf hatchling then you can give it the best possible start in life & hope that it comes to appreciate that you do not constitute any kind of threat to it's wellbeing. I have to say that even though the bad sloughs were the first times that I had to pick up either of my hatchlings, they were far more laid back than all of the hype you get to read about them. Following this sudden revelation I now have no qualms about handling them as often as required, but normally using a hook to lift them out of their territory. I believe that once a snake gets over it's initial panic then with repeated gentle sessions most will become quiet/even tempered captives. They just need to be shown the ropes when young, because we all make some mistakes & the occasional nip from a hatchling isn't going to put anyone off, but a strike from something as large as a yearling will begin to leave negative thoughts in your head. If you handle often you become aware of your snakes characteristics & behaviour. It too becomes used to your scents & handling qualities thus it all goes to perpetuate a blissfull & nirvana like relationship between man & snake. Of personal note is that my cb Macklott's began life in my collection as way more volatile pythons & the female is now as placid as a corn snake. The male does still snipe when he's being lifted out (by hook) but once in hand he soon settles down. Things can change & if you have spent less time than usual with your snake it could become more unpredictable, so only You can be the ultimate judge of how tame your snake/s trully are/remain.
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Herpetologicaly astounded since 1991 & still loving every minute. Pythons eh! What would we do without them?

[Thomas Shanta]

I went round a friends house last weekend(Luke Woolfenden) and held his adult white lips and they were calm as anything and real pleasure to handle,In good condition these snakes are awesome,I think I'm going to have to buy a adult female I've seen advertised .

[poisonjedhead]

Well it would then appear that I have the brother and sister of your snakes, as i got my WLP from Luke about 12 days ago.

I'm happy to say they are incredibly calm little snakes once out their tubs. though very fast and good feeders who seem to have very fast metabolisms passing there meals rather quickly.

Will pay close attention to the humidity, when did your fellows shed.

thanks for the info and good luck with the little serpents, the parents are stunners ain't they.

Big respect Luke, great snakes and great set up you got going there amigo.
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retierd and spending my childrens inheritance.